Turbo AND super-charging
Turbo AND super-charging
I was wondering. What are the hazards of installing a turbo AND a super charger on an engine? Is it even possible? I've heard of at least one elite sports car with a setup like that, but can that be done on a car with an engine that doesn't cost 100 grand? Just wondering.
Re: Turbo AND super-charging
In Reply to: Turbo AND super-charging posted by Kenshiro on January 27, 2000 at 18:33:37:
: I was wondering. What are the hazards of installing a turbo AND a super charger on an engine? Is it even possible? I've heard of at least one elite sports car with a setup like that, but can that be done on a car with an engine that doesn't cost 100 grand? Just wondering.
Okay, A turbo AND a super charger do the same thing. Difference is a super charger takes the air coming into the engine as opposed to a turbo witch takes it's a from the exhaust and force the air into the manifold. Now, can a car be hooked up with a s/c and a turbo? Sure. Would you want to? I don't think so if it's your main source of transportation. It's not just a matter of putting a turbo unit and a s/c on a car, but there are other factors to consider and this is where the big bucks come in. You need to put in a intercooler and should put in an aftercooler if you are running these both, and it also depends on the psi of the boost you are adding. And most importantly, you need a fuel pump that can pump the gas into the engine at the right pressure so the engine doesn't get starved for fuel, because all the turbos and s/c's do is pump in compressed air into the engine. Also, depends on what base car you are gonna use.
Hate to say this, but you gotta start with a car that has a strong foundation. All the power from the turbo or/& s/c won't do you a bit of good if you can't get the power to the wheel. You gotta make sure you have the right gearing, you gotta make sure you have the right suspension, cause when you add that kinda power you are thinking about, you will quickly discover where all the weak links in the car are. I could go on and on...
As far as hazards go... The big one is detonation. That's right, if you are running too high a boost psi, or too low an octane for your s/c or turbo, your engine may explode...
: I was wondering. What are the hazards of installing a turbo AND a super charger on an engine? Is it even possible? I've heard of at least one elite sports car with a setup like that, but can that be done on a car with an engine that doesn't cost 100 grand? Just wondering.
Okay, A turbo AND a super charger do the same thing. Difference is a super charger takes the air coming into the engine as opposed to a turbo witch takes it's a from the exhaust and force the air into the manifold. Now, can a car be hooked up with a s/c and a turbo? Sure. Would you want to? I don't think so if it's your main source of transportation. It's not just a matter of putting a turbo unit and a s/c on a car, but there are other factors to consider and this is where the big bucks come in. You need to put in a intercooler and should put in an aftercooler if you are running these both, and it also depends on the psi of the boost you are adding. And most importantly, you need a fuel pump that can pump the gas into the engine at the right pressure so the engine doesn't get starved for fuel, because all the turbos and s/c's do is pump in compressed air into the engine. Also, depends on what base car you are gonna use.
Hate to say this, but you gotta start with a car that has a strong foundation. All the power from the turbo or/& s/c won't do you a bit of good if you can't get the power to the wheel. You gotta make sure you have the right gearing, you gotta make sure you have the right suspension, cause when you add that kinda power you are thinking about, you will quickly discover where all the weak links in the car are. I could go on and on...
As far as hazards go... The big one is detonation. That's right, if you are running too high a boost psi, or too low an octane for your s/c or turbo, your engine may explode...
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Mr. Know it all
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Re: Turbo AND super-charging
In Reply to: Re: Turbo AND super-charging posted by Crash on January 27, 2000 at 21:04:41:
Once again, I must open my book of knowledge and let it spill into the everlasting stream.
Lets clear one thing up once and for all:
A SUPERCHARGER and a TURBOCHARGER do the same thing, they force air into the engine at a very high pressure. Which means they both take air from the outside!
A TURBO works like this: Hot exhaust gases pass through a TURBINE, which in turn drives an IMPELLER that forces more air into the intake manifold. Got it?
A BLOWER (or SuperCharger) works like this: A belt is hooked directly to the CRANKSHAFT. At the end of this belt is an IMPELLER located under the fancy-shmancy SCOOP that helps funnel the air into the engine. This process forces air into the engine just like a TURBOCHARGER, only it is running all the time. OKAY?
I think the only reason anyone would use both is because they are trying to fabricate a useful Powerband (an analog representation of an engines output power). Maybe they want to "lengthen" the powerband of the engine to make it rev to 14,000+. Other than that, there is no reason to have it.
Hope I have cleared up any grey areas....
Once again, I must open my book of knowledge and let it spill into the everlasting stream.
Lets clear one thing up once and for all:
A SUPERCHARGER and a TURBOCHARGER do the same thing, they force air into the engine at a very high pressure. Which means they both take air from the outside!
A TURBO works like this: Hot exhaust gases pass through a TURBINE, which in turn drives an IMPELLER that forces more air into the intake manifold. Got it?
A BLOWER (or SuperCharger) works like this: A belt is hooked directly to the CRANKSHAFT. At the end of this belt is an IMPELLER located under the fancy-shmancy SCOOP that helps funnel the air into the engine. This process forces air into the engine just like a TURBOCHARGER, only it is running all the time. OKAY?
I think the only reason anyone would use both is because they are trying to fabricate a useful Powerband (an analog representation of an engines output power). Maybe they want to "lengthen" the powerband of the engine to make it rev to 14,000+. Other than that, there is no reason to have it.
Hope I have cleared up any grey areas....
Re: Turbo AND super-charging
In Reply to: Re: Turbo AND super-charging posted by Mr. Know it All on January 28, 2000 at 09:45:34:
: Once again, I must open my book of knowledge and let it spill into the everlasting stream.
: Lets clear one thing up once and for all:
: A SUPERCHARGER and a TURBOCHARGER do the same thing, they force air into the engine at a very high pressure. Which means they both take air from the outside!
: A TURBO works like this: Hot exhaust gases pass through a TURBINE, which in turn drives an IMPELLER that forces more air into the intake manifold. Got it?
: A BLOWER (or SuperCharger) works like this: A belt is hooked directly to the CRANKSHAFT. At the end of this belt is an IMPELLER located under the fancy-shmancy SCOOP that helps funnel the air into the engine. This process forces air into the engine just like a TURBOCHARGER, only it is running all the time. OKAY?
: I think the only reason anyone would use both is because they are trying to fabricate a useful Powerband (an analog representation of an engines output power). Maybe they want to "lengthen" the powerband of the engine to make it rev to 14,000+. Other than that, there is no reason to have it.
: Hope I have cleared up any grey areas....
And, isn't that what I basically just said? Not a flame, just pointing that out...
: Once again, I must open my book of knowledge and let it spill into the everlasting stream.
: Lets clear one thing up once and for all:
: A SUPERCHARGER and a TURBOCHARGER do the same thing, they force air into the engine at a very high pressure. Which means they both take air from the outside!
: A TURBO works like this: Hot exhaust gases pass through a TURBINE, which in turn drives an IMPELLER that forces more air into the intake manifold. Got it?
: A BLOWER (or SuperCharger) works like this: A belt is hooked directly to the CRANKSHAFT. At the end of this belt is an IMPELLER located under the fancy-shmancy SCOOP that helps funnel the air into the engine. This process forces air into the engine just like a TURBOCHARGER, only it is running all the time. OKAY?
: I think the only reason anyone would use both is because they are trying to fabricate a useful Powerband (an analog representation of an engines output power). Maybe they want to "lengthen" the powerband of the engine to make it rev to 14,000+. Other than that, there is no reason to have it.
: Hope I have cleared up any grey areas....
And, isn't that what I basically just said? Not a flame, just pointing that out...
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Mr. Know it all
- Posts: 23
- Joined: Thu Jul 22, 1999 4:14 pm
Re: Turbo AND super-charging
In Reply to: Re: Turbo AND super-charging posted by Crash on January 28, 2000 at 11:07:41:
No, you said (and I quote):
[Difference is a super charger takes the air coming into the engine as opposed to a turbo witch takes it's a from the exhaust and force the air into the manifold.]
Are you saying a Turbo is taking hot exhaust gases and forcing them into the intake manifold? I sure hope not.
Just wanted to point that out.
No, you said (and I quote):
[Difference is a super charger takes the air coming into the engine as opposed to a turbo witch takes it's a from the exhaust and force the air into the manifold.]
Are you saying a Turbo is taking hot exhaust gases and forcing them into the intake manifold? I sure hope not.
Just wanted to point that out.
Re: Turbo AND super-charging
In Reply to: Re: Turbo AND super-charging posted by Mr. Know it All on January 28, 2000 at 09:45:34:
Sounds like your "book of knowledge" has a few errors in it. Superchargers (of the type that sit atop the motor as you describe) do not have impellers, they have LOBES. This is not a trivial difference--one that should be noted by anyone calling themselves Mr. KIA.
A blower type supercharger is classified as a "positive displacement" compressor, whereas a "turbo"-type is a "dynamic" compressor.
An impeller is a single rotating element with straight or curved radial (from center-to-outside rim) fins. Air enters the center and is flung outward (like an automotive water pump), as you noted in the turbocharger application.
In the supercharger (aka Blower) of the type in MM, two intermeshing (but not touching) figure 8-shaped lobe act to stuff more air into the machine. No fins, no centrifugal action. This is not nit-picking. they do not "impel" and nobody calls them impellers, at least nobody who "knows it all".
Sounds like your "book of knowledge" has a few errors in it. Superchargers (of the type that sit atop the motor as you describe) do not have impellers, they have LOBES. This is not a trivial difference--one that should be noted by anyone calling themselves Mr. KIA.
A blower type supercharger is classified as a "positive displacement" compressor, whereas a "turbo"-type is a "dynamic" compressor.
An impeller is a single rotating element with straight or curved radial (from center-to-outside rim) fins. Air enters the center and is flung outward (like an automotive water pump), as you noted in the turbocharger application.
In the supercharger (aka Blower) of the type in MM, two intermeshing (but not touching) figure 8-shaped lobe act to stuff more air into the machine. No fins, no centrifugal action. This is not nit-picking. they do not "impel" and nobody calls them impellers, at least nobody who "knows it all".